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Yeah, I've had to deal with that in the Straights of Gibraltar, its pretty freaky the first time you encounter it. One minute you're extremely heavy and the next you're extremely light. On a nuclear powered boat you just put on some speed and drive through it. A diesel boat on it's batteries doesn't have anywhere near that power That being said, I'm not buying it. The crew would have had time to conduct an emergency blow and surface the boat unless they were incredibly slow to recognize that they had lost depth control.Nyte_Byrd wrote: ↑Fri Apr 30, 2021 9:19 am Doomed Indonesian sub may have been hit by powerful underwater wave: report
https://www.foxnews.com/world/doomed-in ... ave-report
I wonder if with an older sub if there were contributing factors involved, including the possibility of crew late or inaction as you mentioned? I recall the cases of the USS Scorpion and Thresher. Wonder if the crews had time to realize their impending doom or if things happened very quickly.subvet wrote: ↑Sun May 02, 2021 3:03 amYeah, I've had to deal with that in the Straights of Gibraltar, its pretty freaky the first time you encounter it. One minute you're extremely heavy and the next you're extremely light. On a nuclear powered boat you just put on some speed and drive through it. A diesel boat on it's batteries doesn't have anywhere near that power That being said, I'm not buying it. The crew would have had time to conduct an emergency blow and surface the boat unless they were incredibly slow to recognize that they had lost depth control.Nyte_Byrd wrote: ↑Fri Apr 30, 2021 9:19 am Doomed Indonesian sub may have been hit by powerful underwater wave: report
https://www.foxnews.com/world/doomed-in ... ave-report
In the case of THRESHER, yes, they knew what was happening and fought all the way to implosion. Likewise, SCORPION was aggressively maneuvering in what appears to be an attempt to shut down a hot running torpedo. Unlike THRESHER, it looks like their case is closer to what happened to KURSK. With regards to the article and in all due deference to the Captain, we were in a cold war and technology gains with their accompanying capabilities were critical to outpacing the Soviets. Since there's no free lunch, those gains came with risks such as learning how to operate with the expanded safe operating envelope, operate a ship with less reserve buoyancy, and learn the hydrodynamics associated with the new hull form. The 594 class led to the 637 class which ultimately became the workhorse of the submarine fleet for several decades. The 688 class and 726 class both represented massive changes to design, size and performance with each lead ship of the class taking on the role as the experimental ship where we learned to operate them. Now they're on the way out with 774 class delivering its 19th boat and the COLUMBIA program working its way to delivery. Not to ramble on, but we do incremental improvements within a ship class and transformational improvements with new ones. No different than aircraft, this has risks and you need to manage them.John wrote: ↑Sun May 02, 2021 3:33 amI wonder if with an older sub if there were contributing factors involved, including the possibility of crew late or inaction as you mentioned? I recall the cases of the USS Scorpion and Thresher. Wonder if the crews had time to realize their impending doom or if things happened very quickly.subvet wrote: ↑Sun May 02, 2021 3:03 amYeah, I've had to deal with that in the Straights of Gibraltar, its pretty freaky the first time you encounter it. One minute you're extremely heavy and the next you're extremely light. On a nuclear powered boat you just put on some speed and drive through it. A diesel boat on it's batteries doesn't have anywhere near that power That being said, I'm not buying it. The crew would have had time to conduct an emergency blow and surface the boat unless they were incredibly slow to recognize that they had lost depth control.Nyte_Byrd wrote: ↑Fri Apr 30, 2021 9:19 am Doomed Indonesian sub may have been hit by powerful underwater wave: report
https://www.foxnews.com/world/doomed-in ... ave-report
A bit off topic, but this was just published a few months ago regarding the Thresher:
https://www.kitsapsun.com/story/news/20 ... 173822001/
Excellent perspective. Thanks very much.subvet wrote: ↑Mon May 03, 2021 2:11 amIn the case of THRESHER, yes, they knew what was happening and fought all the way to implosion. Likewise, SCORPION was aggressively maneuvering in what appears to be an attempt to shut down a hot running torpedo. Unlike THRESHER, it looks like their case is closer to what happened to KURSK. With regards to the article and in all due deference to the Captain, we were in a cold war and technology gains with their accompanying capabilities were critical to outpacing the Soviets. Since there's no free lunch, those gains came with risks such as learning how to operate with the expanded safe operating envelope, operate a ship with less reserve buoyancy, and learn the hydrodynamics associated with the new hull form. The 594 class led to the 637 class which ultimately became the workhorse of the submarine fleet for several decades. The 688 class and 726 class both represented massive changes to design, size and performance with each lead ship of the class taking on the role as the experimental ship where we learned to operate them. Now they're on the way out with 774 class delivering its 19th boat and the COLUMBIA program working its way to delivery. Not to ramble on, but we do incremental improvements within a ship class and transformational improvements with new ones. No different than aircraft, this has risks and you need to manage them.John wrote: ↑Sun May 02, 2021 3:33 amI wonder if with an older sub if there were contributing factors involved, including the possibility of crew late or inaction as you mentioned? I recall the cases of the USS Scorpion and Thresher. Wonder if the crews had time to realize their impending doom or if things happened very quickly.subvet wrote: ↑Sun May 02, 2021 3:03 am
Yeah, I've had to deal with that in the Straights of Gibraltar, its pretty freaky the first time you encounter it. One minute you're extremely heavy and the next you're extremely light. On a nuclear powered boat you just put on some speed and drive through it. A diesel boat on it's batteries doesn't have anywhere near that power That being said, I'm not buying it. The crew would have had time to conduct an emergency blow and surface the boat unless they were incredibly slow to recognize that they had lost depth control.
A bit off topic, but this was just published a few months ago regarding the Thresher:
https://www.kitsapsun.com/story/news/20 ... 173822001/